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 Post subject: Guitar sculpting
PostPosted: 14 Jul 2011, 20:32 
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Hi There,

I use Art cam pro in my cabinet making business (mostly 2d components) but I would like to create some guitar components.
I have all the 2d cut outs prepared, but cant seem to find the right relief combination to make a 'waist' contour on the back of the body.
I have tried a 2 rail sweep using 5 different sections, and i have tried drawing in Sketch Up and importing an STL file, but i cant seem to get the toolpath to ONLY cut the contour, and NOT the outline.

Here are a few screen shots to illustrate what i am trying to achieve.

Any pointers to a good tutorial would be great, I just need to see the principles in action to understand which relief tool to use.
Even better would be suggestions on how to achieve this particular relief.

Many thanks


Attachments:
sketch up screen shot 1.jpg
sketch up screen shot 1.jpg [ 363 KiB | Viewed 4267 times ]
art cam screen shot 2.jpg
art cam screen shot 2.jpg [ 626.6 KiB | Viewed 4275 times ]
art cam screen shot 1.jpg
art cam screen shot 1.jpg [ 627.67 KiB | Viewed 4262 times ]
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 Post subject: Re: Guitar sculpting
PostPosted: 15 Jul 2011, 02:13 
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Joined: 03 Jul 2005, 21:42
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draw a vector around what you wish to cut then choose the vector when doing a 3d toolpath.
mike


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 Post subject: Re: Guitar sculpting
PostPosted: 15 Jul 2011, 11:27 
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Hi Mike, thanks for the response.

I have the shape drawn with vectors (two connecting arcs), my question was more aimed at how to achieve the concave cut.
Which 3d relief tool would you use? ........should I be drawing a third arc in Z for the tool to follow, or use a two rail sweep and sections?

Most of the methods I try seem to give me an approximation of the cut, but I really want it to be exactly as drawn.

The video attached shows what I am trying to achieve at 2.50 mins.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cBBExnv- ... re=feedlik


Many thanks


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 Post subject: Re: Guitar sculpting
PostPosted: 15 Jul 2011, 21:35 
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Joined: 13 Jul 2006, 18:43
Posts: 233
Location: Poland
Hint:
use the 3d blend tool,
select first the outer vector, then the inner,
next click on the concave button in the function, set up the height of the outer (e.g. 20 mm) then the inner (e.g. 40 mm) and click add.
Your done :)

just a quick edit: both of the vectors have to be closed outline vectors, you should check out the chocolate mould tutorial in the AC Pro tutorials then you'll get it, it's really easy
cheers
Adam

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 Post subject: Re: Guitar sculpting
PostPosted: 16 Jul 2011, 03:27 
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Adam hits the nail dead on. as far as cutting this thing out........ are you asking what toolpaths to use? if so....... for the rounded or concaved areas use raster with a ball end mill, for the pocket and the profile use the profie toolpath just be certain you choose inside for the inside and outside for the outside.
mike


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 Post subject: Re: Guitar sculpting
PostPosted: 19 Jul 2011, 20:48 
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Joined: 23 Jan 2010, 15:27
Posts: 16
Help!

Can't seem to get the desired effect, in fact I have several fundamental problems;

1. Positioning the relief at the correct height (it seems to be cutting above the block relative to the profile cut)

2. Finding the correct vector combination. I have the two lines I wish to use on separate layers so I can select them separately.

3. Finding the correct 3d blend. I have tried all the options in the tool, concave , smooth and linear and get bizarre results.

I must be doing something really stupid !

Here are a couple more screen shots to show you how I am setting up.

I have the tool selection sorted, and can cut the outline...that's about it


Attachments:
File comment: this was the linear blend, two seperate vectors on two seperate layers. I selected the outer first, then the inner. defined the depth, generated the blend and then selected my tool...bizarre result.
art cam screen shot 9.jpg
art cam screen shot 9.jpg [ 833.29 KiB | Viewed 4249 times ]
File comment: this was the result of the concave blend
art cam screen shot 8.jpg
art cam screen shot 8.jpg [ 643.25 KiB | Viewed 4250 times ]
File comment: tooling paths
art cam screen shot 5.jpg
art cam screen shot 5.jpg [ 774.49 KiB | Viewed 4243 times ]
File comment: 3d blend set up
art cam screen shot 4.jpg
art cam screen shot 4.jpg [ 531.06 KiB | Viewed 4248 times ]
File comment: material set up
art cam screen shot 3.jpg
art cam screen shot 3.jpg [ 657.5 KiB | Viewed 4240 times ]
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 Post subject: Re: Guitar sculpting
PostPosted: 20 Jul 2011, 01:35 
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SAINTY,
There are a couple other options you can use, you can use the shape editor, the 2 rail sweep, extrude.
I haven't a clue as to what depth (excuse me you said 20mm) or curvature you are after. if you use f12 (shape editor) you can double or some other sized vectors to get the shape depth you are after, then take the outline of the shape you want and zero the rest (hopefully I am clear here, this is way too simple to do compaired to explaining). Just make a large circle and use the shape editor and see if that will do it for you (subtract) then take the contour of the shape you want zero the rest then the shape you want.
here's a file at what I am talking about.
mike


Attachments:
button.art [939.5 KiB]
Downloaded 302 times
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 Post subject: Re: Guitar sculpting
PostPosted: 20 Jul 2011, 12:20 
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Joined: 13 Jul 2006, 18:43
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If you post the file I will prepare the vectors for you
cheers
Adam

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 Post subject: Re: Guitar sculpting
PostPosted: 20 Jul 2011, 21:57 
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Joined: 23 Jan 2010, 15:27
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Hey Mike,

Many thanks for your suggestions, but I am afraid that without a bit more info, I am still groping in the dark.
I tried drawing a circle at the correct radius, then f12 , chose the dome , set a curve and then hit the subtract button...the resulting relief was not what i wanted! :)
My impatience to get this simple cut away machined is getting to me! I usually cut these by hand with woodworking tools, but i really do need to get this method sorted to get full use out of my cnc.
I will definatley need to study the tutorials more. My CNC machine was bought for purely 2d processing and was in service within a day of arrival, so none of us have studied the bigger picture yet.

I think I will take up Adam's kind offer to set up the vectors for me, then perhaps I can study his file and work backwards to the process start point.

Many thanks , and keep up the great work.

Alan.


Attachments:
2414d4950f12707552d8dfdba3dfa352.jpg
2414d4950f12707552d8dfdba3dfa352.jpg [ 576.53 KiB | Viewed 4240 times ]
File comment: Hey Adam, here is the file .
The two vectors that define the area I want sculpting are on separate layers.
The inner vector is on RASTERS layer, the outer line is on ROUTING.
The maximum depth of the sculpting should be 20 mm from the upper face. The block is 34 mm thick.
I have attached a picture of the guitar in question .

UPPER WING WAIST CONTOUR.art [186 KiB]
Downloaded 273 times
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 Post subject: Re: Guitar sculpting
PostPosted: 21 Jul 2011, 05:17 
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Joined: 15 Feb 2010, 14:47
Posts: 110
Would you like to create something like this?


Attachments:
Guitar2.jpg
Guitar2.jpg [ 87.73 KiB | Viewed 4236 times ]
Guitar.jpg
Guitar.jpg [ 96.3 KiB | Viewed 4235 times ]
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 Post subject: Re: Guitar sculpting
PostPosted: 21 Jul 2011, 06:17 
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Guess I was kind of slow on the draw, you are all right there redox61 I was just going to get his dimensions and redo this but I see you did it first. :lol: good one.
mike


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 Post subject: Re: Guitar sculpting
PostPosted: 21 Jul 2011, 09:18 
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Joined: 23 Jan 2010, 15:27
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redox61 wrote:
Would you like to create something like this?



Brilliant!!!!

Yes, that is exactly what I was trying to achieve.
Were you able to use the vectors in my file, or were these re drawn?

Can you explain this to me, or send me your file so I can study it please. I am using Art cam Pro 2008 version.
It is the principles that mystify me, any further explanation of the process would be most welcome, for future reference.

Many thanks.... to both of you,

Alan.


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 Post subject: Re: Guitar sculpting
PostPosted: 21 Jul 2011, 16:00 
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Joined: 15 Feb 2010, 14:47
Posts: 110
Sorry Mike. :D
SAINTY, I can't send art file because I have other version of ArtCAM and you can't open this file. Because try to download this archive http://depositfiles.com/files/4qkay20ot
It contains eps vector file and short video. Pay attention that height of cross-section vector must be equal to relief height. Try to make other shapes of cross-section to obtain result which you would like.


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 Post subject: Re: Guitar sculpting
PostPosted: 21 Jul 2011, 18:45 
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Joined: 23 Jan 2010, 15:27
Posts: 16
redox61 wrote:
Sorry Mike. :D
SAINTY, I can't send art file because I have other version of ArtCAM and you can't open ithis file. Because try to download this archive http://depositfiles.com/files/4qkay20ot
It contains eps vector file and short video. Pay attention that height of cross-section vector must be equal to relief height. Try to make other shapes of cross-section to obtain result which you would like.

Hi there,
Thank you so much for the video and vectors.
I managed to get a similar result to your model.

I have 2 problems.
1. I only wanted to cut the waisted part , not the complete shape as the block will be cut to shape using a different cutter and tool path in the 2d profile section.
It will take forever to cut this out of a solid block.
is it possible to just select the waisted part?

If you look at this You tube video , it shows a guitar waist being cut. (go to 3.00 mins.)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cBBExnv- ... re=related

2. I was concerned about the location of the wooden block in the model.
I usually zero my cutters from the top surface, then the g code is set to cut below this point.
My axies seem to be above the block, but your axies seem to be below it? (see picture) I assume it is a matter of setting the material up, and the correct off set position? any tips?


Attachments:
File comment: this is how I set up my material simulation
HOW ITS DONE 1 MATERIAL SET UP.jpg
HOW ITS DONE 1 MATERIAL SET UP.jpg [ 548.9 KiB | Viewed 4243 times ]
RESULT 1 IS AXIS POSITION CORRECT.jpg
RESULT 1 IS AXIS POSITION CORRECT.jpg [ 826.12 KiB | Viewed 4238 times ]
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 Post subject: Re: Guitar sculpting
PostPosted: 21 Jul 2011, 20:06 
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Joined: 15 Feb 2010, 14:47
Posts: 110
Look these pictures


Attachments:
3dview.jpg
3dview.jpg [ 273.87 KiB | Viewed 4252 times ]
2dview.jpg
2dview.jpg [ 285.63 KiB | Viewed 4253 times ]
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